| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
|
 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:13 pm Post subject: Free Press April 28, 2011 (Thursday) |
 |
|
Interesting ending ...
| Code: | Puzzle: FP042811
+-------+-------+-------+
| 1 . . | . . . | . 7 . |
| . . 7 | 4 . . | 8 . 9 |
| . 5 . | 8 6 . | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | 5 . 9 | 3 . . |
| 5 . . | . . . | . . 7 |
| . . 2 | 3 . 6 | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 9 . | . 5 8 | . 2 . |
| 8 . 1 | . . 2 | 9 . . |
| . 3 . | . . . | . . 1 |
+-------+-------+-------+ |
Keith |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Coloring; r8c2<>6 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
After basics: | Code: | +-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 1 48 48 | 9 2 3 | 5 7 6 |
| 6 2 7 | 4 1 5 | 8 3 9 |
| 3 5 9 | 8 6 7 | 2 1 4 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 47 1 68 | 5 478 9 | 3 46 2 |
| 5 68 3 | 2 48 1 | 46 9 7 |
| 9 47 2 | 3 47 6 | 1 5 8 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 47 9 46 | 1 5 8 | 467 2 3 |
| 8 467 1 | 67 3 2 | 9 46 5 |
| 2 3 5 | 67 9 4 | 67 8 1 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+ |
Why make it simple?
Bug+3: R5C5 = 8. 
(Actually, I used the kite on 6 in R5C8 to make the same elimination as Marty.)
There is also a W-wing 46 that takes out 6 in R4C3.
Keith |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| keith wrote: | After basics: | Code: | +-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 1 48 48 | 9 2 3 | 5 7 6 |
| 6 2 7 | 4 1 5 | 8 3 9 |
| 3 5 9 | 8 6 7 | 2 1 4 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 47 1 68 | 5 478 9 | 3 46 2 |
| 5 68 3 | 2 48 1 | 46 9 7 |
| 9 47 2 | 3 47 6 | 1 5 8 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 47 9 46 | 1 5 8 | 467 2 3 |
| 8 467 1 | 67 3 2 | 9 46 5 |
| 2 3 5 | 67 9 4 | 67 8 1 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
|
Bug+3: R5C5 = 8.
|
Hmmm! My BUG+n logic is really rusty, so that may explain why I'm having trouble with your BUG+3.
I can see r4c5<>4 and r8c2<>4 contributing to a BUG outcome. I can also see how they contribute to your conclusion of r5c5<>4=8.
Where I'm running into trouble is finding a candidate in r7c7 that contributes to a BUG outcome.
r7c7<>4 leaves a hidden single, r6c7=4, so it can't be used.
r7c7<>6 leaves a hidden single, r7c3=6, so it can't be used.
r7c7<>7 leaves a hidden single, r7c1=7, so it can't be used.
Regards, Danny |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
peterj
Joined: 26 Mar 2010
Posts: 974
Location: London, UK
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I played a skyscraper but I guess..
| Code: | BUG+3 ; r5c5<>4=8
(4)r4c5
||
(4)r8c2 - r6c2=r6c5
||
(4)r7c7 - (4=6)r7c3 - (6=8)r4c3 - r4c5=r5c5 |
[Edit] Ah!  Danny, I see you're saying that it's not actually a BUG because of r7c7 - I looked in r7 for 4 as the BUG-stopper but looking in c7 would suggest 6. I agree |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I probably don't know enough about BUGs, but I thought the killer had to have three occurrences in the row, column and box and r7c7 doesn't have that.
| Quote: | | (Actually, I used the kite on 6 in R5C8 to make the same elimination as Marty.) |
I am still having difficulty calling these things Kites as opposed to Simple Coloring. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I'm not familiar with Networks. But it's hard to get used to change when it differs from what one learned originally. And when I originally learned Kites, they were just perpendicular Skyscrapers, both of which were weakly linked, thus, they were both simple forms of Multi-coloring. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 1:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Marty R. wrote: | I am still having difficulty calling these things Kites as opposed to Simple Coloring.
|
Sorry, I didn't realize this was just a comment on your part. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 2:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
Danny,
Good catch! This is not a BUG!
I looked at C7 and B9, the BUG killer in R7C7 must be 6. I did not check R7.
So, this presumed BUG+3 fails in only one of the 9 tests; Row, Column, Block for each of the three tri-values.
Marty,
You are correct. What I pointed out is, strictly, not a kite.
To further confuse the issue: What I actually noticed was that the triple 468 in R5 can be extended (transported) by 46 so that R5C2 and R8C8 are pincers in 6. It just seemed simpler to point out the strong links in R5C8 and (sloppily) call it a kite.
Keith |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tlanglet
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2468
Location: Northern California Foothills
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 2:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| keith wrote: | So, this presumed BUG+3 fails in only one of the 9 tests; Row, Column, Block for each of the three tri-values.
Keith |
Keith, I believe that r8c2 also fails the test for 4 in r8.
Ted |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ronk
Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 398
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Code: | +-------------+-------------+-------------+
| 1 48 48 | 9 2 3 | 5 7 6 |
| 6 2 7 | 4 1 5 | 8 3 9 |
| 3 5 9 | 8 6 7 | 2 1 4 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
|*47 1 68 | 5 #478 9 | 3 *46 2 |
| 5 68 3 | 2 48 1 | 46 9 7 |
| 9 47 2 | 3 47 6 | 1 5 8 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+
|*47 9 #46 | 1 5 8 | 467 2 3 |
| 8 *467 1 | 67 3 2 | 9 *46 5 |
| 2 3 5 | 67 9 4 | 67 8 1 |
+-------------+-------------+-------------+ |
Near BUG grids always have invalid almost-conjugate-loops, aka broken-wings ("bw"), aka oddagons. In the above, were it not for guardians 4r4c5 and 4r7c3 (tagged '#'), there would an invalid conjugate loop of length 5 (tagged '*'), so at least one of r4c5=4 and r7c3=4 must be true.
(4)r8c8 = (4)r4c8 - bw:[(4)r4c5 = (4)r7c3] - (4)r8c2 = (4)r8c8 ==> r8c8=8 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| tlanglet wrote: | | keith wrote: | So, this presumed BUG+3 fails in only one of the 9 tests; Row, Column, Block for each of the three tri-values.
Keith |
Keith, I believe that r8c2 also fails the test for 4 in r8.
|
Ted: I missed that one as well. _  _
Ron: I noticed your loop with guardian cells, but wasn't sure about discussing it. I'm glad you found it noteworthy. I especially like your chain construction! (note: r8c8=4)
Regards, Danny |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Asellus
Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Posts: 865
Location: Sonoma County, CA, USA
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Question for ronk: Do these oddagons occur in true near-BUG grids or only, as here, in predominantly bivalue grids which are not capable of becoming BUGs? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
So,
I feel like the second baseman who has made two errors and has been taken out of the game. But, the game remains very interesting!
Keith |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ronk
Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 398
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 2:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Asellus wrote: | | Do these oddagons occur in true near-BUG grids or only, as here, in predominantly bivalue grids which are not capable of becoming BUGs? |
Both. I've no statistics for this but, when considering grids with the same number of unsolved cells, I suspect there are slightly more oddagons in the "true" near-BUG grid. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
