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keith

Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 8:36 pm Post subject: Free Press Apr 02, 2010

Not yet done:

Code:

Puzzle: FP040210
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . 5 | . . . | . . . |
| . . . | 7 . 3 | 5 4 . |
| . . 8 | . 9 . | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 8 . | . 4 . | . . 9 |
| 5 . . | 6 . 7 | . . 2 |
| 1 . . | . . . | . 3 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 2 . | . 7 . | 9 . . |
| . 7 . | 2 8 1 | . . . |
| . . . | . . . | 8 . . |
+-------+-------+-------+

Keith

keith

Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:49 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Grouped SS -3; XY + coloring -3; XY -6.

Marty R.

Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:57 pm Post subject:

Quote:

An ER (3) exposed a W-Wing (46)

keith

Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:03 pm Post subject:

After basics:

Code:

+----------------+----------------+----------------+
| 7 1346 5 | 148 126 468 | 236 9 136 |
| 269 169 69 | 7 126 3 | 5 4 8 |
| 2346 1346 8 | 145 9 456 | 236 7 136 |
+----------------+----------------+----------------+
| 36 8 7 | 13 4 2 | 16 5 9 |
| 5 349 349 | 6 13 7 | 14 8 2 |
| 1 46 2 | 89 5 89 | 7 3 46 |
+----------------+----------------+----------------+
| 8 2 346 | 345 7 456 | 9 1 34 |
| 349 7 349 | 2 8 1 | 34 6 5 |
| 346 5 1 | 349 36 469 | 8 2 7 |
+----------------+----------------+----------------+

You could also start with the 36 W-wing.

Keith

storm_norm

Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1741

Posted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:40 am Post subject:

mug {489} r169

notice that the 8's and 9's are in x-wings
the only other 4's in those rows to stop the MUG are in r1c2 and r9c1
r3c1 <> 4

Code:

+--------------------+-------------------+-------------+
| 7 136(4) 5 | 1(48) 126 6(48) | 236 9 136 |
| 269 169 69 | 7 126 3 | 5 4 8 |
| 236-4 1346 8 | 145 9 456 | 236 7 136 |
+--------------------+-------------------+-------------+
| 36 8 7 | 13 4 2 | 16 5 9 |
| 5 349 349 | 6 13 7 | 14 8 2 |
| 1 46 2 | (89) 5 (89) | 7 3 46 |
+--------------------+-------------------+-------------+
| 8 2 346 | 345 7 456 | 9 1 34 |
| 349 7 349 | 2 8 1 | 34 6 5 |
| 36(4) 5 1 | 3(49) 36 6(49) | 8 2 7 |
+--------------------+-------------------+-------------+

basics remain.

Luke451

Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 310
Location: Southern Northern California

Posted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:16 pm Post subject:

storm_norm wrote:

mug {489} r169

notice that the 8's and 9's are in x-wings
the only other 4's in those rows to stop the MUG are in r1c2 and r9c1
r3c1 <> 4

I'm liking it, Norm!

I think that it's not a MUG, though.

That there's a BUG-Lite (all bivalues/Bivalue Universal Grave.)

storm_norm

Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1741

Posted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:10 pm Post subject:

Luke451 wrote:

storm_norm wrote:

mug {489} r169

notice that the 8's and 9's are in x-wings
the only other 4's in those rows to stop the MUG are in r1c2 and r9c1
r3c1 <> 4

I'm liking it, Norm!

I think that it's not a MUG, though.

That there's a BUG-Lite (all bivalues/Bivalue Universal Grave.)

thinking you are right.
and was hoping someone might bring that up because this particular example might get lost in the translation.

this is the thread I have used the most in trying to wrap my head around distinguishing them.

http://www.sudoku.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=4432&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Luke451

Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 310
Location: Southern Northern California

Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:24 am Post subject:

storm_norm wrote:

mug {489} r169

notice that the 8's and 9's are in x-wings
the only other 4's in those rows to stop the MUG are in r1c2 and r9c1
r3c1 <> 4

Code:

basics remain.

I'm not clear on the nuance btwn layered BUG-Lites and MUGs, that's for sure! I'm trying to understand this stuff myself, so take whatever I say as the ramblings of a neophyte.

I do think it's safe to say that a MUG is the composite of at least two BUG-Lites that overlap in at least one cell. Layered BUG-Lites also require at least two BUG-Lites. The pattern above is definitely deadly, but cannot be broken down into more than one BUG-Lite.

Interesting also, a unique rectangle is a BUG-LIte. So two or more overlapping URs form a MUG. The above pattern cannot be broken down into overlapping unique rectangles, either.

Every pattern that I've ever seen someone call a MUG can be broken down to its composite BUG-Lites or a series of overlapping unique rectangles. I'm also trying to think if I've ever seen a "MUG" whose DP components didn't have at least one cell with three values in it. (Layered Bug-Lites seem to be a different story.)

nataraj

Joined: 03 Aug 2007
Posts: 1048
Location: near Vienna, Austria

Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:31 am Post subject:

keith wrote:

After basics:

Code:

You could also start with the 36 W-wing.

Keith

Start with it and be done ...

The same pattern 36-13 (in row 4) 13-36 (in column 5) can be viewed both as a w-wing (that removes 6 from r9c1) and a kite (that removes 3 from r9c1). Together they set r9c1=4 and nothing but singles from there.

I liked this one a lot. Basics were interesting and the VH twist was nice.

tlanglet

Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2468
Location: Northern California Foothills

Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 12:56 pm Post subject:

storm_norm wrote:

this is the thread I have used the most in trying to wrap my head around distinguishing them.

http://www.sudoku.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=4432&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Norm,

As usual, you made another great find. For fun I looked at the outside columns and, as might be expected, it also resulted in the critical deletion.
The 4's were in r3c46 and r7c46, an a little transport does the deed.
(4)r3c46 - r3c12 = r1c2 - r6c2 = r6c9,; r7c9<>4.

The real reason for this post is that the link to the MUG thread did not work; I get the critical error message: "Could not connect to the database".

Ted

Luke451

Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 310
Location: Southern Northern California

Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:32 pm Post subject:

tlanglet wrote:

The real reason for this post is that the link to the MUG thread did not work; I get the critical error message: "Could not connect to the database".

Ted, the link is good, but Players is down. The site seems to have its annual scary-looking crash.

tlanglet

Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2468
Location: Northern California Foothills

Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:12 pm Post subject:

Luke451 wrote:

tlanglet wrote:

The real reason for this post is that the link to the MUG thread did not work; I get the critical error message: "Could not connect to the database".

Ted, the link is good, but Players is down. The site seems to have its annual scary-looking crash.

Luke & Norm,

I tried this link again today and it takes me to the "Game House" home page.

Is the Player's forum still out of business?

Ted

Luke451

Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 310
Location: Southern Northern California

Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 7:56 pm Post subject:

tlanglet wrote:

Luke451 wrote:

tlanglet wrote:

The real reason for this post is that the link to the MUG thread did not work; I get the critical error message: "Could not connect to the database".

Ted, the link is good, but Players is down. The site seems to have its annual scary-looking crash.

Luke & Norm,

I tried this link again today and it takes me to the "Game House" home page.

Is the Player's forum still out of business?

Ted

Hi, Ted. Very sadly, the answer is yes. See this thread above.

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